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Moltres analysis

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Moltres analysis

Post by polelover44 on Tue Feb 23, 2010 9:22 pm

Introduction to Moltres:



Base Stats:

HP: 90
Min: 321/ Max: 384

Atk: 100
-Min: 212 / Min: 236 / Max: 299 / +Max: 328

Def: 90
-Min: 194/ Min: 216 / Max: 299 / +Max: 306

SpAtk: 125
-Min: 257 / Min: 286 / Max: 349 / +Max: 383

SpDef: 85
-Min: 185 / Min: 206 / Max: 269 / +Max: 295

Spe: 90
-Min: 194 / Min: 236 / Max: 299 / +Max: 306

*Note: All stats factor 31 IVs


Pressure: Each of your opponent's attacks consume one additional PP when used (they can still use moves with 1 PP remaining).


Why Use Moltres?
Moltres is arguably one of the most underrated Pokemon in the game. Base 125 Special Attack, 100 Attack, and decent bulk and speed make it a great sweeper, even tank. Moltres can counter Scizor better than its counterpart, Zapdos, due to better Defense and STAB Fire Blast. It also gets an excellent Special move for its Secondary STAB in Air Slash. Its 100 Base Attack stat allows it to be able to use U-Turn and other physical moves reasonably well, and even giving it a decent Choice Band set to use as a Novelty.



Physically Defensive

Moltres @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Bold Nature (+ Defense, - Attack)
EVs: 252 HP / 228 Def / 28 SP. Atk
-Fire Blast/Flamethrower
-Air Slash
-Roost/Morning Sun
-Hidden Power Grass/Ice

Set Description:

This set may seem like an inferior version of the Standard Zapdos set on Smogon, but it has a few important advantages. Fire Blast has more Base Power than Heat Wave, and Moltres gets STAB on it. Flamethrower is an option over Fire Blast for reliability, because all you really have to do here is fry Scizor, which you could to with Fire Spin in Rain. Air Slash, which Zapdos doesn't get, has a flinch rate and hits fighting types like Machamp and Gallade for high amounts of damage. And for those who don't like the loss of flying ability that Roost gives, Moltres' Morning Sun is also an option. Morning Sun lets you restore 100% of your health in Sun, but in Rain, Hail, and Sand, it restores only 25%. It also retains the Electric weakness, and keeps the Rock weakness at 4x. 252 HP EVs hit a Leftovers recovery point, 384, so Moltres regains 28 HP each turn. 228 Defense lets me take 2 Waterfalls or Aqua Tails from Swampert and still have a reasonable amount of HP remaining. The remaining 28 put in Special Attack allow you to have a 100% chance of scoring a 2HKO on Starmie with HP Grass, and to always OHKO Salamence with HP Ice. Fire Blast may 2HKO Zapdos with Leftovers, and will always 2HKO with Stealth Rock up. This set can also work with the Charti Berry, which decreases your Rock weakness from 4x to 2x once, allowing Tyranitar to NEVER OHKO, even with Sandstorm. That won't help much, as you can't do anything to Tyranitar, and then Sandstorm might kill you anyway, but it's better than nothing.

Calcs, assuming you've spun away rocks first:
CBScizor Bullet Punch vs. Moltres: 63 - 75 (16.41% - 19.53%)
Max Attack no boosting item Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. Moltres (with Charti Berry): 284 - 336 (75.13% - 88.89%)
Mixpert Waterfall vs. Moltres: 150 - 176 (39.06% - 45.83%)
Tentacruel Surf vs. Moltres: 194 - 230 (50.52% - 59.90%)
Starmie Surf vs. Moltres: 296 - 350 (77.08% - 91.15%)
Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. Moltres: 284 - 336 (73.96% - 87.50%)
Moltres HP Grass vs. Starmie: 144 - 170 (54.96% - 64.89%)
Moltres Fire Blast vs. Zapdos: 175 - 207 (45.69% - 54.05%)
Moltres Air Slash vs. Heracross: 420 - 496 (166.67% - 196.83%)
Moltres HP Ice vs. Salamence: 336 - 396 (101.51% - 119.64%)



Moltres @ Choice Scarf/Specs
Ability: Pressure
Timid Nature (+ Speed, - Attack) or Modest (+SAtk, - Atk)
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Spe / 252 SP.Atk
-Fire Blast
-Air Slash
-Hidden Power Grass/Ice

Set Description:
This is Moltres' most used set, and for good reason. As a lead it's competitively viable, and even as a mid-late game sweeper it works. Fire Blast and Air Slash provide amazing STABs, and HP Grass or Ice, Grass being preferred for watery reasons, provide great coverage alongside the two. In the third slot, Extrasensory hits Tentacruel only, while U-Turn and Overheat are great for hit n' run. The EVs given allow it to hit speed ties with Lucario, Roserade, and Porygon-z if Specs'd, and Scarf Pory-Z if Scarf'd. Timid is given over Modest because Modest Scarf can't OHKO Swampert with HP Grass, and Timid Specs can. However, Modest gives you a 100% chance of a 2HKO on Salamence with Air Slash and without SR, and a 100% chance of a 2HKO on Flygon with Air Slash and without SR, so it's definitely something to consider. Modest Specs gives you a 100% chance of OHKOing Salamence with SR and Air Slash, or will deal up to 92% damage to Flygon, so a weakened Flygon doesn't stand a chance. Fire Blast ensures an OHKO on standard AgilitySubPetaya Empoleon, dealing a minimum of 100.00% damage. This can be a great lead, and, if you remove rocks, can also come back and sweep lategame.

CBScizor Bullet Punch vs. Moltres: 88 - 104 (27.33% - 32.30%)
Scarf HP Grass vs. Mixpert: 328 - 388 (81.19% - 96.04%)
Scarf HP Grass vs. Starmie: 170 - 202 (64.89% - 77.10%)
Modest Specs Fire Blast vs. Standard Empoleon: 312 - 367 (100.00% - 117.63%)



Moltres @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
Modest Nature (+ Speed, - Attack)
EVs: 64 HP / 4 Def / 188 Spe / 252 SP.Atk
-Fire Blast
-Air Slash
-Hidden Power Grass/Ice

Set Description:
This is basically the same as the last set, with the exception of Agility. After a single Agility, Moltres outspeeds everything viable in OU that isn't Scarf'd, and many things that are. STAB Fire Blast hits Scizor, Forretress, and more, and Air Slash hits Breloom and Heracross, along with Machamp and other annoying fighters. Hidden Power Grass hits Swampert and other Waters, while Hidden Power hits Dragons, which you pretty much already check. Agility is what makes this set different from the Choice set. The EVs here allow you to outspeed common Scarfers Latias and Gengar after a single Agility by one point, and you get pretty decent Bulk, and 11 uses of Life Orb, with 337 HP. The 4 Defense EVs can easily go in Special Defense, but in the end, they don't really matter. Modest lets you always 2HKO annoying Scarfers like Flygon with Air Slash, and allows you to OHKO Swampert with HP Grass 100% of the time. Many walls are OHKOd or 2HKOd, and will not want to switch in on you. Moltres' combination of types, along with Hidden Power Grass, allows it to screw over combos like Forretress/Swampert, or Scizor/Swampert. Two of the three types in the common Water/Fire/Grass combo (Water and Grass) are hit with Super Effective moves from Moltres.

HP Grass vs. Standard Mixpert: 464 - 548 (116.00% - 137.00%)
HP Grass vs. min/min Starmie: 244 - 288 (93.13% - 109.92%)
Air Slash vs. Standard DDGyara: 171 - 202 (51.51% - 60.84%)
Air Slash vs. Standard Mixnite: 171 - 202 (52.94% - 62.54%)
Fire Blast vs. Standard Cresselia: 217 - 256 (48.87% - 57.66%)
Fire Blast vs. Standard Hippowdon: 318 - 375 (75.71% - 89.29%) (More than HP Grass)
Fire Bast vs. Standard Defensive Rotom-A: 256 - 303 (84.21% - 99.67%)
Fire Blast vs. Scarf Rotom-A: 256 - 303 (105.79% - 125.21%)


Sunny Day Sweeper

Moltres @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
Timid Nature (+ Speed, - Attack)
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Spe / 252 SP.Atk
-Fire Blast
-Hidden Power Ice
-Sunny Day/Morning Sun

Set Description:
This works best on a Sun team. If you already have Sun up, Morning Sun is definitely preffered, as it can restore up to 100% HP. Solarbeam + Sun is the ultimate Grass attacking combo, as you have a 100% accurate 120 Base Power Grass move which always OHKOs Swampert (OMG!). Fire Blast hits extremely hard in Sun, and is epic. Super Effective Air Slash will actually do LESS than normally effective Fire Blast, so we have Hidden Power Ice for the Dragons. If you don't have Sun on the team, or you don't feel you have enough sun, Sunny day is good, and can also be used for defensive purposes, as water moves are 50% effective in Sun. The problem with using this set is that there aren't very many good spinners in Sun. Starmie and Tentacruel are out of the question, being Water types, and Forretress would be decimated by Fire Spin. Hitmontop, actually, works well on a team with this set, being a spinner that doesn't mind Sun. Donphan works well, too, as Water moves, one of its weaknesses, are themselves weakened. However, this set is absolutely devastating when you manage to use it, and many people will not expect it.

Fire Blast vs. Standard Rotom-h: 384 - 453 (126.32% - 149.01%)
Solarbeam vs. Gyarados: 181 - 214 (54.52% - 64.46%)
Hidden Power (Ice) vs. 224 HP/216 SDef Calm Dragonite: 316 - 372 (83.38% - 98.15%) - OHKO with SR
Solarbeam vs. SP. Defensive Mixpert (236 HP/216 SDef, Sassy): 576 - 680 (144.00% - 170.00%)
Solarbeam vs. CurseTar (No SS): 270 - 318 (66.83% - 78.71%)
Solarbeam vs. CurseTar (SS): 180-212 (44.55%-52.48%)
Solarbeam vs. CBTar (No SS): 332 - 392 (86.91% - 102.62%)
Solarbeam vs. CBTar (SS): 222-262 (58.12%-68.59%)
Solarbeam vs. Scarfmie: 416 - 490 (158.78% - 187.02%)



Moltres @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Timid (+ Speed, - Attack)
156 HP / 160 SpD / 192 Spe
Roost/Morning Sun

Set Description:
Another set stolen off Zapdos, again with advantages. This is walled completely by Heatran, as it's immune to Toxic and Flamethrower. Substitute gives you a chance to take any hit, and get up a free move. All this Substituting will go to your head, so it's good to heal up once in a while with Roost or Morning Sun. The Roost vs. Morning sun debate is mentioned below, and is difficult to solve. Flamethrower provides you with good STAB, and is more reliable STAB than Fire Blast, although Fire Blast hits harder, and is better for the sweeper sets. The last slot is given over to Toxic and Roar, which are both good. Roar can get rid of Heatran, which is always annoying, and Toxic hits the flyers/levitaters who are immune to Toxic Spikes. The Speed lets it outspeed Neutral-natured Base 95s, as they hit 289 Speed and I hit 290, and the rest were split between HP and Special Defense. With Air Slash, you still beat Scizor, but Flamethrower is preferred in that respect.

CBScizor Bullet Punch vs. Moltres: 88 - 104 (24.44% - 28.89%)
Flamethrower vs. CBScizor: 600 - 708 (174.93% - 206.41%)
Classic Mixmence Draco Meteor vs. Moltres: 214 - 253 (59.44% - 70.28%)
+1 Latias Draco Meteor vs. Moltres: 292 - 345 (81.11% - 95.83%)
Moltres Flamethrower vs. Standard Defensive Rotom: 118 - 139 (38.82% - 45.72%)
Moltres Flamethrower vs. Scarf Rotom: 118 - 139 (48.76% - 57.44%)
Scarf Rotom Thunderbolt vs. Moltres: 258 - 306 (71.67% - 85.00%)
Standard Rotom Thunderbolt vs. Moltres: 204 - 242 (56.67% - 67.22%)


A Choice Band set is reasonably viable, with Return/Double Edge, Steel Wing, U-Turn, and Aerial Ace/Sky Attack. Mixtres is also novelty, with Fire Blast/Air Slash/ HP Grass or Ice/Return or Double Edge. Charti Berry is acceptable wherever Leftovers are mentioned in the sets, for Rock defense.

Moltres is actually very hard to counter. There are only 4 Pokemon that I consider true counters, and Tres lols at a lot of Pokemon - see my "Pokemon that this Pokemon counters" section.


True Counters:
Tyranitar - Tar can take anything from Moltres unless there's Sun, and when Tar switches in, there won't be.
Heatran - Heatran can take anything, and fire back.
Tentacruel - Tenta can take all but Specs Extrasensory, and NOBODY uses Extrasensory on anything other than Tenta.
Blissey - It's flying hot dog covered with salami Blissey. It can take anything Moltres will throw at it, and completely stall it out.
Snorlax - Snorlax can take anything Moltres gives it, and Body Slam will easily eat Moltres for breakfast after a Curse or 2.
Latias - Moltres never OHKOs. Latias outspeeds and OHKOs with Surf


Empoleon - 2HKOd by Fire Blast, OHKOs.
Flygon - 2HKOd by Air Slash (Sometimes). Outspeeds and OHKOs with Stone Edge
Gengar - OHKOd. Outspeeds and OHKOs.
Gyarados - 2HKOd by Moltres. OHKOs Moltres.
Kingdra - Moltres never OHKOs, but Kingdra does.
Starmie - Starmie is 2HKOd by HP [Grass], but it outspeeds non-scarfed Moltres and OHKOs.
Suicune - 2HKOd by Moltres. OKHOs with Surf.
Jolteon - Jolteon is OHKOd by Fire Blast, but outspeeds and OHKOs.
Vaporeon - Vaporeon is 2HKOd by HP [Grass], and it OHKOs, even though Moltres outspeeds.


Special Mentions:
Swampert - Swampert is sometimes OHKOd by HP Grass/Solarbeam. When it isn't it OHKOs.
Zapdos - Standard Zappy is OHKOd (with Rocks) 62% of the time. Otherwise, it OHKOs.


this Pokemon is a counter to:
Breloom - Moltres just laughs at Seed Bomb and Focus Punch. I can let another Pokemon be Slept, then switch Moltres in on the Sub and take my time.
Celebi - HP Fire, Grass Knot, and Earth Power to nothing to Moltres, only the rare Psychic will damage it at all. Moltres' two STABs are both SE on Celebi.
Forretress - Only Explosion even dents Moltres, and that would take down Forry, as well.
Infernape - HP Ice or the rare Thunderpunch or Stone Edge are the only things that harm Moltres, and Moltres can OHKO with either STAB.
Machamp - Moltres doesn't like Stone Edge, but can switch in on a Dynamicpunch, then OHKO with Air Slash.
Ninjask - Ninjask is destroyed by either STAB, and can't hit back.
Scizor - Scizor's Bullet Punch hits Moltres for low damage, and Tres outspeeds and OHKOs otherwise.
Skarmory - Skarm can't do BLEEP! to anything, let alone Moltres, and Fire Blast is an easy OHKO.
Metagross - Outspeeds, but is scared by Rock Slide and Thunderpunch. With the right prediction, Tres can come in and win.


Pokemon that this Pokemon can at least somewhat check.
Lucario - Speed tie. OHKOd by the rare Stone Edge
Mamoswine - Outspeeds, can't survive Stone Edge on switch.
Weavile - Outsped but not OKHOd. OHKOs.
Heracross - Non-scarfed Hera is outsped. Scarfhera is outsped by Scarftres. Stone Edge on the switch can flatten Tres.
Gallade - Stone Edge is scary, but I outspeed and OHKO
Hitmontop - See Gallade. None of its priority scares me.

Team Options:
A Rapid Spinner, obviously, is mandatory. Starmie, Tentacruel, and Forretress don't work well with the Sunny Day set, but work very well with other sets.

A Moltres/Swampert/Celebi combo gives you the classic Water/Fire/Grass combo, while the three cover each others' weaknesses. You can also use any other Bulky Water, but Swampert is best, because it resists the scary Rock type.


Morning Sun or Roost?
Morning Sun and Roost are Moltres' two big healing moves, and both have their advantages and their disadvantages. Roost makes Moltres susceptible to Ground moves, but removes its Electric weakness (although any Electric move will then KO it the next turn). Morning Sun can restore 100% HP in sun, and keeps it immune to Ground moves, but in Sand, Rain, or Hail, only restores up to 25%. In the end, it's up to you which one you fear more.


Moltres is a very underrated Pokemon. I have attempted to show you its usefulness, and hope to see you using it more in the future!


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